1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Canadian Forging Press Sales?

Discussion in 'Canadian Suppliers' started by kmcghee, Mar 14, 2018.

  1. kmcghee

    kmcghee New Member

    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    I am a teacher in a high school and would live to get a small forging press for my metalwork class, and while I could easily build one, it is not permitted, all equipment must be CSA approved so I need to find one that is for sale that is, or I have to buy one and have it CSA approved, anyone sell these commercially in Canada?
     
  2. Shawn Parkinson

    Shawn Parkinson New Member

    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    3
    I've been looking for a forge press in Canada as well and had no luck. There are a few options out of the US but they are expensive and would still have to be csa approved. I think your best option would be to buy a shop press, get the school to approve it and then modify it with proper dies and maybe some better support.
     
  3. Brad

    Brad Active Member

    Likes Received:
    77
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Modifying a commercial press is probably the best way to go. A regular shop press would need to cycle much faster to work well for forging. Replacing the pump with a high flow one would be a good start.
     
  4. Shawn Parkinson

    Shawn Parkinson New Member

    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    3
    I figured I should do un update. This spring I bit the bullet and bought a 22 ton log splitter from HomeDepot for $1300.00. Got about 20ft of 6" U channel from the scrap yard for $70 (for reinforcement and a table). picked up a 5hp electric motor and had to get a shaft coupler from princess auto for $300, and I had to buy a few hydraulic pipe fittings and nipples to extend the hoses, about $200 from mcmastercarr. I sold the gas motor for $300 to offset the electric motor cost. So all in the cost to build was around $2k. Much cheaper than anywhere else I found to buy one, plus shipping it up to the great white north. check out the Skwisher II here https://photos.app.goo.gl/zCyDpT5EPgj6UvUS6
     
    John Noon likes this.
  5. dancom

    dancom Dust Maker Best Shop Tool

    Likes Received:
    829
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Wow, that's pretty cool. I have often though about doing the log splitter to press retrofit. Good job!
     
  6. ToddR

    ToddR Putterer, Tinkerer, Waster of Time Staff Member

    Likes Received:
    205
    Trophy Points:
    43
    That's cool. I admire those with the vision to look at something and see several possibilities.
     
  7. bubba682

    bubba682 New Member

    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Just ordered the steel for my frame prices are goin up thanks to the tarrif hopefully the cutting and welding will start this weekend.
     
  8. bubba682

    bubba682 New Member

    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Did you make the dies and what did you use or did you buy them..
     
  9. John Noon

    John Noon Well-Known Member

    Likes Received:
    546
    Trophy Points:
    113
    If the individual parts like the electrical components have a CSA sticker you may be good to go. Those are the parts likely to start fires and such
     
  10. FORGE

    FORGE Maker of the Year Best Knife

    Likes Received:
    267
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Staring fires is the least of your worries when you are dealing with a hydraulic press the isn't designed properly both from a structural point of view and the integrity of the hydraulics as well.
    I have designed and worked on systems that have output forces in excess of 7,000,000 pounds of force in steel mills and systems that have operated at 60,000 psi on pipe testing equipment.

    I have also seen hydraulic cylinder rods bend so much on knife forging presses, that I have left the seminar for fear of being killed.
    People simply do not realize how much force is in a hydraulic system until something lets loose and the machine flies apart.
    That is why my press has a 3 inch cylinder rod in a 5 inch bore cylinder with 4 spiral hose and all the frame was structurally engineered and way over designed to prevent any catastrophic failure.
     
    dancom and John Noon like this.
  11. John Noon

    John Noon Well-Known Member

    Likes Received:
    546
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Good points. I imagine a school would need engineered drawings especially if a wood splitter gets modified
     
  12. dancom

    dancom Dust Maker Best Shop Tool

    Likes Received:
    829
    Trophy Points:
    113
    An you know for sure a Chinese press will not have CSA on it. The factory will put a CE mark on it, but CSA is a whole other can of worms for them. Special inspections would need to be done to probably no less than three different standards. I deal with special inspections every week from the electrical side of things and these are generally not a problem if you use approved components and have a P. Eng. with a stamp handy.

    Some things are inherently more dangerous than others. The human brain is the only thing preventing a foot operated press from squashing someone's hands. And if you watch YouTube, you know what a relatively safe shopping cart can do when operated by idiots. It's like asking for a CSA approved chainsaw. Finger safe with full wrap-around chain guard? LOL
     
    John Noon likes this.
  13. John Noon

    John Noon Well-Known Member

    Likes Received:
    546
    Trophy Points:
    113
    We had a shop shut down after the thirtieth visit by health and safety, every time he fired someone for not showing up to work for a week or three they filed a complaint.

    The straw that broke the Camels back was heath and Safety said the drill press had to have a light curtain, two hand operation for power and a guard around the drill bit. When he got the guard and installed it there was no way to get the part on the table and drilled. He asked her to drop by and explain how it was safer and her response was if you can't make parts then no one can get hurt.

    Then she handed him a shopping list of parts to buy to upgrade the press to the tune of 100 grand. He even got a fine for a damaged CSA placard on a piece of equipment and was made to replace it or shut the shop down.


    My fun time was going in explaining the ins and outs of randomly modifying equipment and lifting gear. Owner dropped that on the lap of the health and safety people which was followed by ear shattering silence and no more visits
     
  14. FORGE

    FORGE Maker of the Year Best Knife

    Likes Received:
    267
    Trophy Points:
    63
    That is the big problem with OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND STUPIDITY. Most of the people there are government academics that have never worked in the REAL WORLD.
    Don't get me wrong I am all for workplace safety but some of the CRAP these people come up with is just stupidity.
    The last time I was in a lumber mill in BC I had to wear more junk to be safe that I was a hazard to myself just to walk, let alone move around equipment.
     
    John Noon likes this.
  15. Mythtaken

    Mythtaken Staff Member CKM Staff

    Likes Received:
    228
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I have to agree with that. Speaking as one of the people who wrote many H&S policies and procedures, I can say the biggest problem with all of it is pure laziness. None of the so-called subject matter experts ever bother to take a look at all the existing processes to ensure what they're doing makes sense. It's easier just to throw out another fix to satisfy regulations, instead of creating something that all works together. You end up with a patchwork that doesn't let people do the job properly, so they often ignore the policies.

    Reminds me of years ago when I was a manager at a well-known armoured transport company. Every year they did a security audit and every year my guys failed. Why? Because there weren't any security policies provided to the branches and the auditors weren't allowed to share any with us.
     
    John Noon likes this.
  16. dancom

    dancom Dust Maker Best Shop Tool

    Likes Received:
    829
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The pressure is on the employers. In Alberta, the New Dippies mandated all businesses with 20 or more employees have a Joint Workplace Health & Safety Committee (JWHSC) comprised of employees and management. That means every month we have to do (and document) hazard assessments around the shop, however frivolous. Hey, I see an extension cord on the floor! That's a tripping hazard! I'm sorry, but extension cords will always be on the floor at some point. It's what an extension cord does. Maybe we can put together a course on how to safely step over an extension cord? Good idea Dan, we'll get someone right on that.

    Of course there will be audits, and warnings and fines for those businesses who fail to comply. Worker's Comp premiums going down? No. Has it made our products more expensive? Yes. If the plan is to drive good jobs away, it seems to be working. The guys down in Mexico are loving this stuff. Sorry for the rant.

    Dan
    Management Member of JWHSC
     
  17. John Noon

    John Noon Well-Known Member

    Likes Received:
    546
    Trophy Points:
    113
    actually the "Solution" as H&S puts it is place a ramp over the cord for a smooth transition. of course that doubles the height and may prove a difficult obstacle for some so it will need yellow strips so people can see the cord cover.

    Oh and warning signs at least six feet away stating there is a hazard on the floor, then there is the daily sheet where everyone in the work area has to sign off on all hazards and review safe work practices.

    All this should take only an hour or two each day from my experience on the pipeline jobs
     
  18. ToddR

    ToddR Putterer, Tinkerer, Waster of Time Staff Member

    Likes Received:
    205
    Trophy Points:
    43
    In my opinion, the entire issue with H&S is that it's an extension of the principle that we can mandate common sense and that it's not our responsibility as individuals to exercise good judgement. Obviously some laws and regulations are useful and make sense. But when we start talking about documenting and requiring rules, as mentioned above, about silly things like extension cords we're basically saying that people are not smart enough to deal with these things. And if they trip over one, it's not their fault. No matter how much you write, how detailed you get or how many personal safety devices you invent people will ALWAYS make mistakes and accidents will happen. If we are put in a situation that doesn't feel right or feels dangerous they need to say "nope" and proceed with whatever company policies or legal means they can. If they just made a mistake or an accident happened you move on as best you can. Hopefully people don't get hurt but sometimes they will. If you work around dangerous stuff it just stands to reason that eventually something will happen. I'm not saying that there aren't irresponsible companies or even criminal ones. But we pander to the lowest common denominator far too much in areas already. This is just the part that extends to the workplace. Joe Numbnuts (any resemblance to names or identities of members in CKM is purely accidental) may have never learned that you shouldn't stick your finger in an electrical outlet but that doesn't mean we all need a 6 hour seminar on how not to play with electricity. To me this is an off-shoot of the whole "safe space" ideology (hopefully I haven't triggered anybody). Enough rules, laws, regulations (so many that nobody can possibly remember) we can prevent anything bad. It's nonsense.

    Whoa... seems I rolled of a decent rant myself there... what's up with that?
     
  19. John Noon

    John Noon Well-Known Member

    Likes Received:
    546
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I found the whole accidents just don't "Happen" and they are preventable mindset to be very annoying and if anyone wants to lick a bare extension cord then let them as far as I am concerned
     
  20. ToddR

    ToddR Putterer, Tinkerer, Waster of Time Staff Member

    Likes Received:
    205
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Heh... yeah, that's just natural selection at work.
     
    John Noon likes this.

Share This Page